Forum: CAT Tools Technical Help
Topic: Internal fuzzy matching: WFP 3.4 x Trados 2011 x MemoQ 6.2
Poster: Bernhard Sulzer
Post title: Don't let others dictate discounts based on arbitrary fuzzy matches
[quote]Samuel Murray wrote:
[quote]Bernhard Sulzer wrote:
These kinds of calculations and calculated results have no great impact on the price I charge. [/quote]
One can calculate rates in many ways, and one method is to align the rate to the amount of time it will take to do the translation. [/quote]
The amount of time it will take to do the translation is not directly (or in any way) proportional to the arbitrary value of a match as per Cat tool. It's arbitrary. What the machine counts as a match isn't a match in the sense that it signifies that in the target text you will encounter the same "match", and it isn't a guarantee that you can use the same word/phrase again that has been used for an idea/concept in a previous TM.
The fuzzy match is NOT an expression of the actual work that goes into translating these "so-called" segment matches. And if a TM is involved, you're dealing with the good or poor quality of it (it could be poor if you use or acquiesce to the demands of an agency to use it). Using a TM without knowing what it's worth or without taking the time to evaluate it wouldn't be professional; I am sure you agree.
[quote]Bernhard Sulzer wrote:
Charging per word is really simply a way to express all that goes into delivering a flawless product. [/quote]
[quote]Samuel Murray wrote:
That is true, and giving discounts for fuzzy matching is really a simple way to express the duration variable of "all that goes into" it. [/quote]
I respectfully disagree. I hold that the fuzzy word match is no measure for the duration of a translation. That's the idea certain agencies use to demand discounts.
Arbitrary percentage values for fuzzy word repetitions by a machine are simply that: completely arbitrary and in no way an expression of how long it will take to translate the text, unless you are talking 100% matches that are 100% matches in the source as well as in the target text.
[quote]Bernhard Sulzer wrote:
Just because we have tools to perform certain (often very insignificant) word analyses doesn't mean we are now calculating our prices based on these analyses. [/quote]
[quote]Samuel Murray wrote:
I think you will find that it does. [/quote]
I don't.
[quote]Samuel Murray listing a few of Bernhard's points:
1. The analysis isn't equivalent (or expresses) the actual amount of work that needs to be performed;
2. it is no measure of the quality of the translation;
3. it is no measure of the experience, the skills and commitment of the translator; [/quote]
[quote]Samuel Murray wrote:
All true, yes. But that doesn't mean fuzzy match statistics are completely useless for price determination. It should simply not be the *only* variable. [/quote]
If you want to use it as a variable, that's your business. And maybe you can, but even so, it should in no way mean right away that you have to give discounts. Speeding up your delivery time and improving consistency of terminology (not necessarily a result of any fuzzy match) should probably be sold at a higher price.
[quote]Bernhard Sulzer wrote:
And that goes for any fields of expertise unless you have 100% repetitions of certain words or numbers in a text that not only are the same in the original text but also in the target text. [/quote]
[quote]Samuel Murray wrote:
Yes, yes, of course, and that is why you should not have one single rate for all types of translation and all types of clients and all types of document formats. However, that does not render the fuzzy match statistics useless for price determination. [/quote]
Never said it had to. But how you use fuzzy matches is your business (not an agency's that will DEMAND it to pay a significantly lower price).
[Edited at 2015-09-17 15:21 GMT]
Topic: Internal fuzzy matching: WFP 3.4 x Trados 2011 x MemoQ 6.2
Poster: Bernhard Sulzer
Post title: Don't let others dictate discounts based on arbitrary fuzzy matches
[quote]Samuel Murray wrote:
[quote]Bernhard Sulzer wrote:
These kinds of calculations and calculated results have no great impact on the price I charge. [/quote]
One can calculate rates in many ways, and one method is to align the rate to the amount of time it will take to do the translation. [/quote]
The amount of time it will take to do the translation is not directly (or in any way) proportional to the arbitrary value of a match as per Cat tool. It's arbitrary. What the machine counts as a match isn't a match in the sense that it signifies that in the target text you will encounter the same "match", and it isn't a guarantee that you can use the same word/phrase again that has been used for an idea/concept in a previous TM.
The fuzzy match is NOT an expression of the actual work that goes into translating these "so-called" segment matches. And if a TM is involved, you're dealing with the good or poor quality of it (it could be poor if you use or acquiesce to the demands of an agency to use it). Using a TM without knowing what it's worth or without taking the time to evaluate it wouldn't be professional; I am sure you agree.
[quote]Bernhard Sulzer wrote:
Charging per word is really simply a way to express all that goes into delivering a flawless product. [/quote]
[quote]Samuel Murray wrote:
That is true, and giving discounts for fuzzy matching is really a simple way to express the duration variable of "all that goes into" it. [/quote]
I respectfully disagree. I hold that the fuzzy word match is no measure for the duration of a translation. That's the idea certain agencies use to demand discounts.
Arbitrary percentage values for fuzzy word repetitions by a machine are simply that: completely arbitrary and in no way an expression of how long it will take to translate the text, unless you are talking 100% matches that are 100% matches in the source as well as in the target text.
[quote]Bernhard Sulzer wrote:
Just because we have tools to perform certain (often very insignificant) word analyses doesn't mean we are now calculating our prices based on these analyses. [/quote]
[quote]Samuel Murray wrote:
I think you will find that it does. [/quote]
I don't.
[quote]Samuel Murray listing a few of Bernhard's points:
1. The analysis isn't equivalent (or expresses) the actual amount of work that needs to be performed;
2. it is no measure of the quality of the translation;
3. it is no measure of the experience, the skills and commitment of the translator; [/quote]
[quote]Samuel Murray wrote:
All true, yes. But that doesn't mean fuzzy match statistics are completely useless for price determination. It should simply not be the *only* variable. [/quote]
If you want to use it as a variable, that's your business. And maybe you can, but even so, it should in no way mean right away that you have to give discounts. Speeding up your delivery time and improving consistency of terminology (not necessarily a result of any fuzzy match) should probably be sold at a higher price.
[quote]Bernhard Sulzer wrote:
And that goes for any fields of expertise unless you have 100% repetitions of certain words or numbers in a text that not only are the same in the original text but also in the target text. [/quote]
[quote]Samuel Murray wrote:
Yes, yes, of course, and that is why you should not have one single rate for all types of translation and all types of clients and all types of document formats. However, that does not render the fuzzy match statistics useless for price determination. [/quote]
Never said it had to. But how you use fuzzy matches is your business (not an agency's that will DEMAND it to pay a significantly lower price).
[Edited at 2015-09-17 15:21 GMT]